“Tigran Sargsyan is making the economy something that is controlled by financial oligarchs from being something that used to be controlled by importing oligarchs. The financial money is a balloon. They adopted a law on compulsory use of cash machines, did it help to increase the tax inflow? According to last year’s information of the Transparency International Armenia was in the 124th place among 151 countries of the world with 47 indicators. This means that there is 47% shadow. The cash has nothing to do with the shadow. The shadow can be in cash or no,” said former prime-minister Hrant Bagratyan during a meeting with journalist when commenting on the bill for limiting cash transactions.
On Monday because of the PA party in the parliament the government’s bill was failed, according to which the government proposed to obligate all parties to make deals and transactions through banks if the amount of the deal would exceed three million drams. The PA did not take part in the voting, as a result of which the bill was failed. The PA claimed that with the mentioned bill the government was trying to enrich the banks on the account of people. In contrast, the government claimed that by doing those transactions through banks the shady deals would be cut down and more taxes would be paid to the budget.
“No. You can go to London, Paris. You can take out all the money you have on your account and do whatever you want with it. The world that has 50-70 years history of market has reached this point slowly. There is competition between banks and their overhead costs are low too. They have come to the conclusion that it is better to do it in cash. You are establishing your own bank and telling everyone that transactions must be done through your bank. This means that you are obligating us to pay a part of your money to you. That’s not the right policy. This must be regulated by the market. There may be 20 or 100 banks. You are depositing money with a bank, and when you take cash, they keep money from that amount. Of course if through the time the economy develops, there will be not 22 but 60 banks and the interest rates will be lower too. Now they are offering expensive services,” said Hrant Bagratyan.
It is worth mentioning that Hrant Bagratyan is a member of the ANC, which is actively discussing issues concerning their proportional list. We asked him about the status of those discussions and when the ANC was planning to publish that list.
– We have agreed in the congress not to comment on that issue and tell everybody to call Zurabyan with that question. Whatever I say now, it will mean that there are intrigues in that. Please ask that question to Levon Zurabyan. We have agreed not to comment on that issue.
– You are a member of the Congress and definitely you will be included in that list.
– No, no. We have honestly agreed not to speak about that. I am working in the economic sector. Before the elections I am ready to give expertise to any MP or party, which will be for free by the way. I am even ready to sit down and work with them.
– At least please say what will be the principle in the ground of the list, what specific professions will be included and how people will be selected.
– If you want to know the truth, in Armenia it is impossible to make good lists because tradition of primaries does not exist here. The first part of the electoral law should start with primaries. The CEC would be better to organize such elections before the real elections. If a party wants to elect a leader, they have to organize preliminary elections. It does not happen in Armenia and all parties simply appoint their leader with non-democratic methods. But the charters of all parties are like that and these procedures are established by the law. Simply we have not developed democracy and have not reached that level of development.
– You said that you could give expertise to any MP and political power. Do you work with any powers on economic projects?
– Of course I cannot bring the details but I am ready to help everyone as an economist. As an economist I do not belong only one political power, I can belong only to myself.
– Are you ready to work on the projects of the RPA and even cooperate with Tigran Sargsyan?
– I am ready to discuss any issue with any party. It is like I am competent in economic issues and I have certain responsibility. I am especially good at macro-economic issues. I am not joking.
– As you are a member of the ANC your announcement and activities may be criticized by your colleagues.
– It is not the business of the Congress and they should not deal with it.
– Are there conflicts within the congress? There are rumors in the media that there are conflicts of interests concerning the proportional lists.
– No, no. I am asking you again not to ask me about the list. Ask about it to Levon Zurabyan.
– Mr. Bagratyan, what do you think about the bill discussed in the government, according to which large supermarkets should be taken out of the city?
– It will be the fifth step of the ANC’s 100 steps, which were written several years ago. They had to establish such large supermarkets first of all; they should not have let them develop top become such big. But I believe they will not do it effectively because they are not the initiators of the idea, thus they don’t know the specific action well. It was two years ago when I said that they had to limit the large shops and supermarkets. They must limit Alexanyan Samvel’s business; he is ruining everything. Now the prime-minister is speaking about it. Is he doing it just for doing or he really wants that?
– The national statistics service recently published the results of the population census, according to which compared to the results of the population census ten years ago approximately 170,000 people have left Armenia. In addition, half million people are out of the country and it is not known yet whether they will return. According to the preliminary information, the population of Armenia is 2,870 million. Do you think this is the real picture of the situation?
– First of all I want to express my discontent about the population census. This is not the way it should be done because one person can be registered for ten times. Usually the way it should be done is with electronic tools, in which they register the details of people, and if there are matching data, the system should reject. Second, in connection with population census I don’t recognize the understanding of permanent people, those who are out of the country or those who will return. There is only one understanding, which is the permanent resident. The statistics service methods are poor. They don’t say how many people there are in Armenia; they only use terms. I want to remind that during the first eight years 280 thousand people have left the country.
– By the way, Tigran Sargsyan has announced for several times that the emigration rate is much lower than during the first ten years of independence. Even more, it was less during the last several years.
– No, the prime-minister is mistaken. Yes, there were high rates of emigration in Armenia but during those times 340 thousand people that emigrated from Armenia were those who came to Armenia from Azerbaijan mainly. They were not citizens but they were registered as permanent residents and then migrants. The prime-minister is not aware of the issue. First, they should understand that following the earthquake 250-270 thousand people left from the country. Those who received shelter in Sochi or other places after the earthquake did not return. We have not seen that at least Yeganyan Gagik would come up with a serious analysis on migration during the long term of his office. If we put these numbers together, we will see that during those years the people that left were not our permanent citizens; 280 people left at that time. After that, in 2010 over 320 thousand people emigrated. Yes, during the war times people left, but the life has changed since then. In Azerbaijan life is getting better and their people are returning. Two years ago 43 thousand people returned, and last year – 110 thousand.